121 Ballots: Gerhart holds lead, Suh & Ingram at #2, then McCoy
Well, the finalists have been announced by the H------ Trophy Trust. As we expected, they are Toby Gerhart, Mark Ingram, Colt McCoy, Ndamukong Suh, and Tim Tebow. The Trust announces them in alphabetical order, but we're glad to see that their top five matches our top five.
With 121 ballots, we're showing Gerhart maintaining his hold on the top spot with strong showings in a number of regions and a projection of 39%. Suh and Ingram continue their virtual tie at 38%, and McCoy right behind at 32%. Tim Tebow is solidly in fourth - but well ahead of the rest of the field at 13%.
Kari Chisholm | December 7, 2009 | Comment on This Post (160 so far) |
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Well behind the rest of the field, I think you mean, concerning Tebow :)
Go Toby!
Posted by: sam | Dec 7, 2009 3:59:20 PM
I'm seeing a lot of ballots in the press with Suh up top. I am pleasantly surprised, I think the Big XII Championship really swayed the voters.
I still am baffled by the last moment rush for Ingram - the guy disappeared in a one-point win against Auburn and wasn't much better against Arkansas, both huge games to keep Alabama's season going, and doesn't break 100 yards in five (5!) games, and is outrushed by his backups in fewer carries against Florida, and he's a Heisman lock?
Posted by: Topher | Dec 7, 2009 4:01:14 PM
You're good enough with numbers to predict the winner every year, but you don't understand that if 4 players are ahead of Tebow, he is fifth, not fourth?
Posted by: Robert | Dec 7, 2009 4:04:37 PM
Robert - I was puzzled by that too, I think they are counting Suh and Ingram as a tie at #2.
Posted by: Topher | Dec 7, 2009 4:08:54 PM
I agree with Topher. But this is a popularity contest nowadays. Plus you have to remember that this only includes about 1/4th of the ballots. It's crazy how many 1st place votes Suh has. I don't see how he can't win.
Posted by: Logan | Dec 7, 2009 4:09:47 PM
I don't understand how you have Suh projected to get less points than Gerhart despite the fact that he has 15 more #1 votes AND 4 more ballot appearances than him, or anybody else for that matter. Are you trying to say that the unknown voter ballots you don't have access to right now don't follow the pattern of the already known votes? This doesn't make sense at all.
Posted by: Mike | Dec 7, 2009 4:12:09 PM
yea that really doesnt make sense. he has a ton more first place votes and he has a total of like 30 more points than the others. that is just the projection by the website so by look of it Suh is technically first
Posted by: Nick | Dec 7, 2009 4:17:17 PM
For all you confused about how Gerhart is projected ahead of Suh even though Suh has more 1st place votes, reading is fundamental. This explanation is available at the Methodology link:
* We count actual votes. We count only the picks from people who claim to be actual voters. (The organization doesn't release a list of voters, so we can't verify.)
* We make two assumptions. 1) That the voter turnout in each region will be equal, and 2) that the undisclosed votes in each region will mirror the publicly disclosed votes,
* Based on those assumptions, we total up the votes in each region and then extrapolate the totals.
* We continually update as more information comes in.
it would appear that Suh's 1st place votes are concentrated in one region. That may change as more public votes are disclosed.
GO TOBY!!!
Posted by: David | Dec 7, 2009 4:19:49 PM
Hey Topher,
You make a comment that you are pleasantly surprised to see a lot of votes for Suh then make the comment about Ingram not rushing for 100 yds in 5 games. In 5 games this season(Florida Atlantic, ARK ST, Lousiana Lafayette, Kansas & Colorado) Suh averaged 4.6 tackles and .20 or 1/5th of a sack. By the way, these teams: 4 finished the year under .500 and 1 finished at .500. Suh got almost half of his 12 sacks in one game against Texas(big stage I grant you) However if a huge performance in a big game is your case for swaying voters shouldn't you also be mentioning CJ Spiller? He ran up over 300 all purpose yards & 4TDS in the ACC title game.
Posted by: Tommy | Dec 7, 2009 4:22:09 PM
Regarding Suh's projection, I think it must be based on regional trends they're seeing. They're doing more than a simple extrapolation of nationwide aggregate votes.
Posted by: Victor Rojo | Dec 7, 2009 4:24:23 PM
Tommy, good work cherry picking statistics. Of the games you mention, only the Kansas and Colorado games were on TV. In the biggest games of the season (V Tech, Mizzou, Oklahoma, and Texas), Suh absolutely dominated those games. The Huskers went 2-2, but could have easily gone 4-0 against those bowl teams as the D gave up just 44 TOTAL points, of which, 9 were scored on last second plays.
Now I can go cherry pick stats for every finalist, but I'll leave that for a Juco stats class to do.
Posted by: Timmy | Dec 7, 2009 4:31:48 PM
I think you have done a good job of predicting past winners, however this year will be different. Your formula will not work in a too close to call situation, which is exactly the situation we are in.
Posted by: bryce | Dec 7, 2009 4:32:09 PM
My god Topher, you couldn't be more wrong about everything you just said about Ingram. Please go back and check the stats before making asinine comments. The only game outside of Auburn that Ingram didn't break 100 yards in are games where he played a quarter, if that....b/c we we're beating that azz. And ummmmmmmmmmm Ingram was the leading rusher in against Florida. You basically stated nothing but lies, and did nothing to attempt to back up those lies. What a child.
Posted by: BmaEngnr92 | Dec 7, 2009 4:33:13 PM
I have noticed that several of your counted votes on your list are wrong. From votes that have both been given on your twitters or public comments made by the voters themselves. Such as Tim Brando, Paul Finebaum, Ray Melick, Spencer Tillman, and Cecil Hurt just to name a few I know for certain have all voted Mark Ingram #1 on their ballots but don't reflect that on any of them. Is this just an oversight?
Posted by: Bill | Dec 7, 2009 4:38:35 PM
A lot of the suh and gerhart fans seem to forget that Ingram has rushed against the best defenses in the country. I don't think one bad game in an undefeated season means he shouldn't get the heisman, especially considering the way he tore apart Florida, the best defense in the country.
Suh is 146th in the country in tackles, not what I would call outstanding. He is 3rd in sacks, but most of those are against offensive lines that allowed several sacks against every team they played.
And Gerhart has big numbers, but again, look at who he's rushing against. The Pac-10 was a joke this year, especially defensively.
Don't get me wrong, I think Suh and Gerhart are both great players and should certainly be 2nd and 3rd with McCoy possibly taking one of their spots. But it's much easier to look like an "outstanding" player when you're playing against high school teams. Ingram has been "outstanding" against the best teams in the country.
Posted by: Archie | Dec 7, 2009 4:40:14 PM
Also just noticed the same with Tom Deinhart and Chris Low.
Posted by: Bill | Dec 7, 2009 4:40:19 PM
BmaEngr,
I haven't stated any lies. You just don't like the way the numbers shake out so you trot out excuses for why the numbers don't look better.
Ingram had 28 carries for 113 yards against Florida. Workmanlike, but not spectacular. His two backups combined for 18 carries and 137 yards, and they both had longer rushes than Ingram in the game. When anyone can pound the football against Florida, it looks more like a bad day for Florida's defense than a superlative effort by one player.
When you throw in the receptions and the TD pass against Notre Dame, Toby Gerhart still bests Ingram's yardage by 200-300 yards, and has over TEN MORE touchdowns. Ingram has to answer for the long sequence where Alabama's offense couldn't find the end zone.
Ingram's good. No doubt. But Heisman material? To paraphrase Paul Tsongas, I've seen good backs and I've seen Heisman winners, and Ingram ain't no Heisman back.
Posted by: Topher | Dec 7, 2009 4:44:13 PM
Given the projections, I'm surprised by Tebow's invite. (I shouldn't be, I imagine.) How does his projected percentage compare with non-invitees from prior years? Or, perhaps more relevant, how does his projected percentage compare with the highest vote-getter to not have been invited?
Posted by: ikey | Dec 7, 2009 4:44:43 PM
The problem with Topher's rationale is that he doesn't take into account the fact that Coach Saban is quick to take out the starters and therefore Ingram doesn't get the opportunity to post big numbers in many games where he sits in the second half because Bama doesn't look for blowouts, just Ws.
Posted by: Legend | Dec 7, 2009 4:45:03 PM
SUH has been a dominant force all year. He will go #1 in the draft. He manhandled Texas even though they held him almost every play and chop blocked him. He had 12 Tackles; 10 solo, 7 for losses, 4 1/2 QB sacks; whjo knows how many QB hurries against the #2 team in the country.
They say defensive players can't win the Heisman...well, not this year. SUH is by far the best College Football player to come out this year and the draft will prove that!! So, you sportswriters and coaches that will vote for the typical RB or QB, SUH will get the last laugh when he signs his guaranteed $45-50 million after he goes #1.
Posted by: Tee | Dec 7, 2009 4:45:45 PM
SUH has been a dominant force all year. He will go #1 in the draft. He manhandled Texas even though they held him almost every play and chop blocked him. He had 12 Tackles; 10 solo, 7 for losses, 4 1/2 QB sacks; whjo knows how many QB hurries against the #2 team in the country.
They say defensive players can't win the Heisman...well, not this year. SUH is by far the best College Football player to come out this year and the draft will prove that!! So, you sportswriters and coaches that will vote for the typical RB or QB, SUH will get the last laugh when he signs his guaranteed $45-50 million after he goes #1.
Posted by: Tee | Dec 7, 2009 4:46:35 PM
Archie,
Wake up and look at the numbers. Gerhart's defensive opponents were better and were ranked higher in the polls than Alabama, and he did his best work against the best defenses he faced.
Aside for Florida, who had a bad game no matter who they were facing (Ingram's backups had huge performances as well), who is so highlt feared on Alabama's schedule? You're not going to get very far with an "OMG SEC soo tougghhh" argument on a statistics-based website.
Posted by: Topher | Dec 7, 2009 4:47:25 PM
Archie,
5 of the 10 Pac-10 teams ended this year in the Top 25, compared to 3 out of 12 for the SEC.
You can continue to spout comments that belie your biases, but you might want to actually pay attention once in a while.
Posted by: dwiesen | Dec 7, 2009 4:50:20 PM
Ingram's backups also had the benefit of playing against defenses who were tired and beaten up after Ingram pounded them for a couple of quarters to soften them up.
Posted by: Legend | Dec 7, 2009 4:54:34 PM
Topher,
you are delusional. What about Ingrams 69 yard screen pass run he had right after florida scored, or his three touchdowns. What about Ingram having to share carries with two other running backs. Oh one more thing, what about Alabama 13-0 record!! That is all.
Posted by: bryce | Dec 7, 2009 4:54:49 PM
Archie, read the following link by ESPN's Ted Miller regarding Pac-10 defenses. And get a reality check.
http://espn.go.com/blog/pac10/post/_/id/6119/myth-vs-reality-defense-in-the-pac-10#comments
Pac-10 was a joke this year? I checked Tennessee went down to the Pac's eighth ranked team (UCLA) and Georgia barely beat out the 9th place team (Arizona State). Some "Pac-1," huh?
This Heisman should be Gerhart's, no questions asked.
Posted by: Zach | Dec 7, 2009 4:55:00 PM
Sorry Topher, Suh isn't going to win it, so there's really no point in playing that game. Just wait and watch how it all shakes out. And about Alabama's schedule? LMFAO, we've played the hardest schedule of anyone on any team that's in the h------- race; that's not opinion, it's fact...look it up. Lastly, Ingram has almost 1000 yards AFTER contact. Again, Suh is good, but some on here act like he's the best defensive guy to ever play the game. I can look back over the past 20 years and probably name 20 better. Lastly, you did nothing to back up your lies. You claim I don't like how the numbers shake out.....well, the experts agree with me and not you, and you'll see come Saturday at the H----------ceremony.
Posted by: BmaEngnr92 | Dec 7, 2009 4:56:03 PM
Good lord, I am SO tired of hearing SEC folks brag about how tough their conference is. "High school teams"? Seriously, Archie??? I'm surprised they could even fit the gigantic SEC ego into the Georgia Dome on Saturday.
"Suh is 146th in the country in tackles, not what I would call outstanding." .... for a defensive tackle, 82 tackles is like a RB putting up 2,500 yards rushing. How about Suh's 10 broken up passes or 19 QB hurries? He also threw in an interception and 3 blocked kicks just for good measure.
"He is 3rd in sacks, but most of those are against offensive lines that allowed several sacks against every team they played. " ... yeah, that offensive line of Texas was pretty pathetic this year. How many all Americans tried to double and triple team him while he racked up his 4 sacks and 12 tackles? THAT'S your Heisman performance of the year.
I could point out dozens of running backs in the past who have put up mildly impressive numbers like Ingram. You'd have to go back a long time to find someone with numbers like Suh had this year.
Posted by: SEC Sucks | Dec 7, 2009 4:59:18 PM
"5 of the 10 Pac-10 teams ended this year in the Top 25, compared to 3 out of 12 for the SEC."
Do you think that might have something to do with the fact that Stanford is the only team in the Pac-10 committed to running the football? In the SEC, Every team tries to establish the run first. There isn't a Pac-10 team out there that would even be in the top half of the SEC in run defense if they faced the same smash mouth offenses every week. So YOU, Sir, can continue to spout comments that belie your biases, but you might want to actually pay attention once in a while.
Posted by: Legend | Dec 7, 2009 4:59:20 PM
Also as for the defenses against the run, you are in a passing conference so those numbers are skewed.
Posted by: bryce | Dec 7, 2009 4:59:43 PM
Just to prove to you "Pac 10" morons....here are the SOS rankings........
Alabama - 4 (yea, I guess that's not "highly" feared, right Topher, lol)
Texas - 30
Nebraska - 47
Stanford - 64 (lmfao)
And these are the teams who have guys in the h------ race. Okay, so what do you all want to argue now?
Posted by: BmaEngnr92 | Dec 7, 2009 4:59:46 PM
The stiff-armed bronzed statue usually goes to pretty boy quarterbacks and fleet-footed running backs. That SUH has crashed the party this year speaks to how absolutely amazing Suh has been this 2009 season.
Only one primarily defensive player (Michigan’s Charles Woodson in 1997) has ever won the award.
Suh has 82 tackles, 23 tackles for losses, 24 quarterback hurries and 12 sacks from a position that generally doesn’t generate flattering statistics.
Posted by: Tee | Dec 7, 2009 4:59:51 PM
OUCH!!!!! Bryce, you didn't have to bring up 13-0 did you?
Posted by: Legend | Dec 7, 2009 5:00:46 PM
ESPN's blatant lobbying for Ingram is shameful. He's certainly not the best RB in the conference, so he can't possibly be the best RB in the country, let alone the "most outstanding player". They seem to be implying that it's more important to get Alabama a Heisman winner than to give the award to the most outstanding player.
Posted by: THT | Dec 7, 2009 5:00:52 PM
For anybody that hasen't had the chance like I have to watch this Big guy play every week just go see http://www.suh93.com/ I haven't seen Toby like alot of you people have and I trust that he is very worthy. I just know that this SUH is one of the best players that I have seen. Being a Nebraska fan I have seen some great defensive players and he is one of the best. Go SUH!!
Posted by: Meek | Dec 7, 2009 5:05:22 PM
Sagarin also has the SEC as the toughest conference AGAIN. Children please....how many beat downs and National Championships will it take for you to get the idea.
Posted by: BmaEngnr92 | Dec 7, 2009 5:07:31 PM
What SOS rankings are you looking at?
I've got Stanford SOS at 19th according to Jeff Sagarin's rankings. Alabama's 20th. Texas is at 44. And Nebraska's is at 48th. For the record, Florida's is at 27th. Still wanna talk smack about our conference?
Posted by: Zach | Dec 7, 2009 5:10:22 PM
Suh sacked Texas quarterback Colt McCoy 4.5 times in the Big 12 Championship game. McCoy had never been sacked that many times by another team during his four-year career at Texas--let alone one player. Nebraska had nine sacks as a team.
Suh’s 4.5 sacks were just 0.5 sack off the Nebraska school record, set earlier this season by his teammate Jared Crick. Those are the top two individual sack efforts in the nation this season.
Suh tied a Nebraska record with seven tackles for loss against the Longhorns. Two of his other five tackles were for no gain, giving him nine tackles in the game for zero or negative yards.
His 12 tackles tied his career high.
Added two quarterback hurries to give him 26 QB hurries this season
Suh on ESPN's College Gameday
Statistics
2009 Season by Game
Opponent TT TFL Sacks QBH
Florida Atlantic 7 1-1 0.0-0 1
Arkansas State 5 3-18 1.5-17 0
at Virginia Tech 8 1-1 0.5-1 1
La.-Lafayette 6 1-0 0.0-0 0
at Missouri 6 1-6 1.0-6 3
Texas Tech 4 2-10 0.0-0 4
Iowa State 8 1-6 1.0-6 3
at Baylor 5 3-5 1.0-3 2
Oklahoma 4 0-0 0.0-0 3
at Kansas 3 0-0 0.0-0 2
Kansas State 9 2-6 1.5-6 1
at Colorado 5 1-17 1.0-17 4
Texas* 12 7-22 4.5-21 2
Season Total 82 23-92 12.0-77 26
*Big 12 Championship in Arlington, Texas
NDAMUKONG SUH CAREER STATS
2009 Video Highlights by Game
* Nebraska vs Florida Atlantic
* Nebraska vs Arkansas State
* Nebraska at Virginia tech
* Nebraska vs La.-Lafayette
* Nebraska at Missouri
* Nebraska vs Texas Tech
* Nebraska vs Iowa State
* Nebraska at Baylor
* Nebraska vs Oklahoma
Posted by: Tee | Dec 7, 2009 5:11:08 PM
Timmy,
First off you're right, I did pick 5 games, as thats what the guy did for Ingram. So let's include all his games. For the season, he averages less than 1 sack per game and just over 6 tackles per game He also had 1 INT and blocked 3 kicks. Now we arent cherry picking these are ALL his numbers. Even if I stipulate that he dominated those games you brought up, The award is for the most outstanding college football player that season, the ENTIRE season. You can give a player some slack for a couple weeks but, almost half a season? I just don't think his season supports an award for the Most Oustanding Player.
Posted by: Tommy | Dec 7, 2009 5:11:16 PM
archie: yes Suh maybe 146th in tackles but he also plays a position that is not known for being leading tacklers. If you look at the 145 players ahead of him, you will notice that he is the first defensive lineman that appears on the list. Everyone ahead of him is a linebacker, corner or safety. add in the fact that he gets double or triple teamed on almost every play and i would say 146th is extraordinary. Maybe before you go spouting about stuff you should try a little research. and remember, stats are like bikinis, they show a lot, but not everything.
Posted by: Craig | Dec 7, 2009 5:15:48 PM
Here you go: http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/polls/119
Not nearly as accurate as Sagarin, but the link I used nonetheless. Also, Ingram averages more yards per carry than Gerhart. Guys, like it or not, when the dust settles, Ingram is taking this things home. It's still early on this site, so it's not showing up yet, but just wait. Cry if you want, doesn't change a thing. Also doesn't change my Pasadena plans, lol.
Posted by: BmaEngnr92 | Dec 7, 2009 5:15:55 PM
And yes, the Pac 10 is behind us, period. The same source you used, Sagarin, has the SEC as the toughest. Still want to argue?
Posted by: BmaEngnr92 | Dec 7, 2009 5:17:18 PM
Topher, "I haven't stated any lies."
oh yeah? what about these?
"When you throw in the receptions and the TD pass against Notre Dame, Toby Gerhart still bests Ingram's yardage by 200-300 yards, and has over TEN MORE touchdowns"
Ingram: 1864 total yards, 279 touches = 6.7 yards/touch, 143.3 yards/g
Gerhart:1885 total yards, 321 touches = 5.9 yards/touch, 157.1 yards/g
Igram: 18 total TD
Gerhart: 27 total TD
Posted by: brad | Dec 7, 2009 5:19:23 PM
If the voters are impartial and do a bit of research they should vote for Gerhart. Hopefully they read this from Friday on ESPN.com
http://espn.go.com/blog/pac10/post/_/id/5981/the-case-for-toby-gerhart
Posted by: Nor-Cal Scott | Dec 7, 2009 5:20:14 PM
Gerhart has 1885 total yards (rushing & passing) averaging 5.6 ypc
Ingram has 1864 total yards (rushing & passing) averaging 6.2 ypc
And let's not even get into the TD discussion. Yes, Gerhart has a TON of TD's. Fact is, we've scored A LOT of touchdowns outside the RZ, and Ingram hasn't been the primary choice in that situation in SEVERAL games. It's not our fault Gerhart has to play ALL game and Ingram has gotten to sit and watch for 5 games.
Posted by: BmaEngnr92 | Dec 7, 2009 5:23:12 PM
I'm laughing and smiling all the way to Cali......
Posted by: BmaEngnr92 | Dec 7, 2009 5:24:21 PM
"Suh is 146th in the country in tackles."
Funny how an argument is made against using absolute statistics against Ingram, saying that one must consider the situation that he is in to explain the statistics. However, a rebuttal argument is instantly made against Suh by using absolute statitistics. I'm not sure if the 146th in tackles in the country is accurate, but I do know that it is irrelevant. What I want to know is, where does he rank among defensive lineman? And where among defensive lineman does he rank in kick blocks and pass breakups. And since we must consider the situation of Ingram sitting down a lot while letting the scrubs play, it must also be considered that Suh did this while being consistently double teamed and not infrequently triple teamed. For a portion of the season, Suh's linemate Jared Crick was leading Suh in tackles. To paraphrase Suh himself, "Its my job to get all the attention, and free up my teammates to make the plays."
The bottom line is: How many times has a Running Back had a year like Gerhart's or Ingram's? How many times has a Defensive Tackle had a year like Suh's?
Posted by: Vyral | Dec 7, 2009 5:26:59 PM
How many guys threw blocks for Ingram and Gerhart? How much of their success is determined by their line. Same goes for McCoy and Tebow - their linemen protect them and they have star receivers to catch their passes and run.
Nobody helped Suh. He was double- and triple-teamed in every single game, and he lit up every offenive lineman he came into contact with. He did it alone - not using great downfield blocking to turn a screen pass into a 70-yard gain.
Suh is the only name in the bunch that is a guaranteed NFL stud. With that said, he'll probably get snubbed by the east coast NAMBLA voters like Frazier did in '95.
Posted by: Girth | Dec 7, 2009 5:29:04 PM
I also noticed this, take the # of carries by each vs. the bottom 3 rushing defenses they faced (parentheses is teams rushing defense rank) :
Gerhart:
Notre Dame (#90) - 29
Washington St. (#117) - 23
San Jose St. (#119) - 24
Ingram:
North Texas (#104) - 8
FIU (#116) - 10
Chattanooga (N/A) - 11
It does say something for Gerhart that Stanford needed him to tote the rock and he did it, but Ingram could have named his number vs. the bottom three rushing defenses he faced, we just took him out in the 2nd quarter.
Posted by: brad | Dec 7, 2009 5:33:02 PM
I think it should come down to Gerhart and Suh. Ingram had a very good year, but with Bama's season on the line in a rivalry game (Auburn), he went 16 carries for 30 yards, and when the game was on the line in the 4th quarter, he was on the sidelines (albeit a bit banged up). I think Ingram will win, but I am curious if a past Heisman winner has ever crapped the bed in a big game during his Heisman season the way Ingram did against Auburn. I doubt it. And, interestingly, Spiller was written off for the same type of game against South Carolina, came back for a monster against G Tech on Saturday, and still couldn't crack the top 5. Curious why Spiller and Ingram are treated differently regarding their bad games. Everyone assumes that Gerhart put up big numbers against worse defenses, but look at the total defense and rush defense numbers of the teams he played vs. those of the teams Ingram played. The numbers don't bear out Ingram playing tougher teams.
Posted by: Mike | Dec 7, 2009 5:36:44 PM
I would like to know what exactly makes the SEC the best conference in the country? To say the Pac 10 and Big 12 are full of high school squads is rediculous to say the least! Just because they are more evenly matched and therefore more competitive with each other, doesn't make them less talented. I would also have to throw the Big 10 into this argument, most years these conferences have more teams get through the season with better records, this year was more competitive, that hardly stands for the argument that they all suck!!
Maybe the SEC is full of bad teams therefore allowing two teams to go undefeated (and overrated). Who knows? Only the bowls will tell. The Heisman has become a joke and so is the BCS (and so is ESPN).
Either way good luck to all and GO SUH!!! If for no other reason than to change it up for once. It's nice to not know the Heisman winner by the end of October for once IMO.
Posted by: Darth_Husker | Dec 7, 2009 5:37:06 PM
Okay, let's not be delusional about Ingram. Yes, Ingram is an excellent back. He in no way should be mentioned in the same breath as H------ Trophy. In his second biggest game of the year (Auburn)...second biggest stage...he was a no show and a non-factor (19 touches for 51 years...2.7 yds per). In Alabama's closest game (in terms of margin of victory...2pts over the Vols) he was held to under 100 yards, INCLUDING receiving. In his biggest game of the year, he had 1 great play (the 69 yard screen pass) and 2-3 decent runs. He had ONE stellar performance...South Carolina.
Anyone who votes him #1 is blind, drunk or stupid....or incredibly biased.
Posted by: BigRedMan | Dec 7, 2009 5:37:28 PM
Tommy,
You're trying to misrepresent Suh's statistics a little bit I think. He has less than 1 sack per game this season? He's 9th in the country in sacks per game; only 5 people have 1 sack or more per game, so your argument doesn't really hold that much weight. He only has one INT this season? He also tipped 10 other passes for a total of 11 defensed passes this season. He's the only defensive lineman in the top 100 of that statistic. The same thing holds for your tackles argument as every single person in the top 100 is an LB or a DB. He only has three blocked kicks this season? How many teams have three or less blocked kicks this season? The only individual person I can think of with more than one is Terrence Cody.
Brent Musberger stated after the B12 championship game, and I quote, "I have never ever seen a defensive player dominate a game in such a manner!" Kirk Herbstreit, who doesn't really like Nebraska a whole lot (I'd say hate, but I doubt he's really that biased), pretty much admitted after the game that Suh is the best defensive lineman he's ever seen play. A number of other pundits have said the same thing. Can you say ANY of the other finalists have had such a performance this season, or that they are even in the conversation as the best player at their position ever in college football?
Posted by: Mike | Dec 7, 2009 5:37:47 PM
I am absolutly dumbfounded that Suh is even invited to go to this award. I never saw this coming. The papers have finally got something right!!(I live in California, not Nebraska). I take back every awful thing I have said about east coast basis, west coast basis. Suh is the best player by far. He was tripled teamed almost every game. The most amazing stat is the DT playing next to him Crick, finished with 2 tacles less. Simply amazing, teams were ready to let Crick make a play unguarded rather then deal with Suh.He also won last years Colorado game where he may have a even better preformance then the Big 12 champ game. If he wins the Heisman the best player in college football will win.
Posted by: pvfresno | Dec 7, 2009 5:39:04 PM
Ingram is not deserving of the trophy. His own teammate out-rushed him in the rivalry game. He doesn't have the best YPC average, nor the most touchdowns. He's behind a tremendous line. He's doing the Emmitt Smith thing. I am a McCoy fan but the honest to God truth is that Suh is the best player in college football and it isn't close. As a 1990 UT graduate I would like to see McCoy win, and I think he honestly deserved it last year (considering that Bradford had a ton of talent around him and the best line I've ever seen and McCoy was playing behind a sieve), but if Suh wins it I'll be okay with that because the guy is a bonafide stud.
Posted by: Bob Wheeler | Dec 7, 2009 5:40:51 PM
Unless Suh can get a ton of second place votes he won't get there. As close as this race is, the candidate who gets the most 2nd place votes is the one to watch.
Posted by: Dave | Dec 7, 2009 5:42:38 PM
SUH will go #1 in the draft regardless of who wins the Heisman.
Regardless of how many yards or tackles a person gets. It's the impact a player has on his team. Leadership, character, integrity, in addition to ability. Intangibles can't be measured.
Posted by: Tee | Dec 7, 2009 5:47:08 PM
Let's look at some more Ingram stats, shall we?
He's #5 in the nation in total rushing yards
You say that's not fair, because he didn't get the pill as often? We-heh-heh-ell, then let's look at PER CARRY average...
He's 28th in the country in yards per rush!
He's tied for 14th in the country for rushing TDs.
He's 13th in the country for number of carries.
Let's now look at Gerhart
#1 in total rushing yards
#51 in yards per rush
#1 in rushing TDs
#1 in number of carries
Gerhart is more resilient than Ingram, has a better nose for paydirt, gained more total yards, and even had a decent per carry average despite carrying the load of his offense and every defense having the luxury of keying on him.
Posted by: BigRedMan | Dec 7, 2009 5:51:39 PM
Omg I never really taught about how good this guy Suh was... You know when he was wooping on the Longhorns there was one lb in the game 50% of the time and rest of the time they were in the Dime. Four man rush produces 9 sacks,15 tfl, he changed that game. That is simply absurd. 0-1 Lb you shouldnt be able to that ever bc a team will run all over you.
Posted by: pvfresno | Dec 7, 2009 5:58:07 PM
All I can say is this,
I respect Suh. Defences win games and that is why Stanford lost three of the four games they lost. I also think Harbaugh being an ex-quaterback goes to the air too soon when the team is behind (but I am not unhappy with what he has done with this program and I hope he stays on the farm for years to come).
There is no doubt that the five are tremendous athletes.
But I have had season ticket for Stanford for many years and I was completely amazed this year. The defensive lines that some of the better Pac-10 team have (USC, Oregon, Cal, Arizona) are so huge that the holes made for Toby were not very large but he would muscle through them. I thought early in the season that he was good enough for the trophy but did not dare hope because I thought I would jinx him.
But when I saw real time when he crushed the Notre Dame Corners and then dragged the safety for another 6 yards before he could get help to bring down Toby I was convinced.
Ingram does not have the numbers and he is not the only one that has a cast of great running backs that get to carry the ball. So many times I would be at the game saying why is Toby on the sideline?
I was talking to a scalper before the Oregon game and I asked him what he thought of Stanford's running back. He said," Toby!?! He will carry you into the end zone with him!!"
Tebow and McCoy have had great careers in college but really have done nothing to get excited about this year as individuals. Ingram has had a great season and will have a great college career ahead of him but again not very exciting.
There is nothing more exciting than watching a big lineman track down a quarterback. But that was one game.
Watching a running back crash through a defenses and them drag then across yardage hanging on all season long. This season was amazing.
I would vote is for Toby but if you are voting on hype Suh should get it.
Posted by: Juan Orosco | Dec 7, 2009 5:59:33 PM
RE: my comment about blocked kicks. Suh is tied for second in the country with three other players. The leader, believe it or not, has 7. And only 26 teams have more blocked kicks than Suh has individually.
Posted by: Mike | Dec 7, 2009 6:05:12 PM
All these guys have Heisman numbers. Here is the difference:
Alabama 13-0
Texas 13-0
Nebraska 9-4
Stanford 8-4
If Suh and Gerhart were Heisman winners they wouldn't have gone home losers four times a piece. Time for a tiebreaker:
Ingram-SECCG: 189 total yards 3 TDs
McCoy-B12CG: 164 total yards 3 Ints, almost the biggest miscue in UT history on second to final play
I'm not saying thats how it should be but judging by past winners thats how it will shake down.
Posted by: Kevin | Dec 7, 2009 6:10:23 PM
After the Texas game, a groundswell of support erupted, prompting national commentators and news media to label Suh as the nation's best player — and worthy of the Heisman.
Posted by: Tee | Dec 7, 2009 6:13:05 PM
Fewer SEC teams FINISH in the top 25 because GREAT teams like Alabama, Florida, and LSU are beating up on the SEC and each other over the course of the season. In the Pac-10 pretty boys like USC still somehow get ranked 20th after embarrassing losses to pathetic teams.
Posted by: Archie | Dec 7, 2009 6:18:12 PM
Do you think you can call it this year or is it too close?
Posted by: S | Dec 7, 2009 6:20:06 PM
One voter (sorry that I can't remember who it was) said earlier today that Suh is probably the best player in the country, but he refused to put him on his ballot because "the H------ is an offensive award". How can you make a comment like that and still be allowed to vote? How many other voters had the same philosophy? The fact that Suh even got invited to NYC despite playing on the other side of the ball just proves how amazing he truly is. I believe he's the first defensive player to even be invited since Woodson (but I'm not sure of that).
How is it possible, in the long and storied history of the H------, that the "best" player in the country is ALWAYS an offensive "skill" player? This is a mindset that needs to be changed.
By the way, what do you think McCoy will do when he sees Suh in NYC? He probably still has some past-traumatic stress from Saturday.
Posted by: I Love Suh | Dec 7, 2009 6:27:22 PM
SEC bias....The defenses are too good, there is too much speed. Tenn should have beaten Alabama this year and they are really effen good, arent they? Ingram did not pound and soften the opponents up for the backups. Its not like Ingram was in and then the backups come in. They are on some type of rotation and his backups had similar statistics....this is NO Heisman winner!
Posted by: Chad | Dec 7, 2009 6:29:58 PM
Without trying to engage everyone here in the petty arguments yelling "my guy's better than your guy" I'll just note that the front page of this site says:
"We've been right seven out of seven years, with our winning vote projection off by an average of only 1.8%."
Right now, the top three players are all clustered within less than that AVERAGE error over all the years the site has been doing projections. Statistically, that means that the top 3 are all essentially tied at the moment, any one could be the winner - too close to call via their methodology.
Posted by: Gary | Dec 7, 2009 6:30:36 PM
hey the people already
spoke...http://promo.espn.go.com/espn/contests/theheismanvote/2009/leaderboard
Posted by: pvfresno | Dec 7, 2009 6:40:46 PM
Ndamukong Suh from Nebraska should win for sure! That would be so awesome for the first defensive player to ever win the heisman!!! Suh is defidently the greatest player in College Football!
Posted by: Bob | Dec 7, 2009 6:44:00 PM
Alabama without Ingram may still be an undefeated team. That's why he shouldn't win the Heisman. They don't even need him. Just plug in Richardson and they don't miss a beat.
Posted by: Troy | Dec 7, 2009 6:45:10 PM
Ingram's numbers could have been matched by Trent Richardson if he had been the #1 option. Suh's numbers - facing constant double and sometimes triple teams - wouldn't be matched by anyone else in the nation.
Tommy... "Florida Atlantic, ARK ST, Lousiana Lafayette, Kansas & Colorado) Suh averaged 4.6 tackles and .20 or 1/5th of a sack" Three of those games were blowouts where Suh wasn't playing much in the 2nd half. Kansas and Colorado have mobile QBs. Even then... your comment doesn't really hold water. A DEFENSIVE TACKLE averaging 4.6 tackles per game is EXCELLENT. Take a look around at other DTs in the country. I'd wager that 75% of them don't have 4.6 average tackles per game, including Alabama's own Terrence Cody who's supposed to be an all-American in his own right.
Ingram didn't hit 100 yards in 4 different games this fall (I'll count 99 as 100 against Tennessee)... 56 yards against FIU ??, 91 against North Texas, 50 against Arkansas, and 30 (!?) against Auburn?
Do stats really tell the whole story?
Oh, and against the BEST OL he faced all year featuring ALL-AMERICAN center Chris Hall and another Heisman finalist (for the 2nd straight year) in quarterback Colt McCoy, Suh had his best game with 12 tackles (7 for loss, 4.5 sacks and 2 more for no gain). Those numbers don't even really explain the havoc he wreaked.
If you think that the SEC is the only place they play defense, I can't wait until Ingram tries to run against Texas' defensive line. And they're nowhere near as good as Nebraska's DL!
Posted by: Sean | Dec 7, 2009 6:45:14 PM
Why do they call M. Ingrham's last game a given for the Heisman Trophy. He rushed 28 for 113 yards 4.0 average. His backup, who I think ran better in the last two games,rushed 11 80 yards 7.3 average. Even the 3rd back had a better average 7 57 yards 8.1 average.Toby Gerhart carried the entire team on his back.Why do yo think this is the first bowl since 2001.
Posted by: willy childers | Dec 7, 2009 7:05:44 PM
Archie,
You say Suh is 146th in tackles. Question: Can you name me an interior lineman close to his total of tackles (except his teammate Crick)? When you combine all his stats, no one (except Crick) is close. Look for Crick to be in the discussion in a year or two.
Besides, much of his dominance doesn't translate into a statistic. For instance, coach Pelini has stated that in their scheme, collapsing the pocket is the goal of the D-line; sacks are just a bonus. No pocket collapse statistic. No category for "throwing off two blocker and forcing the QB to run back to the middle." You get the point - I hope...
Have you watched the way he manhandles 300+ lb. linemen? Did you see him tackle McCoy with one arm while being held by a blocker? Notice how he can chases down a RB 20 or more yards down field? Did you notice he has virtually no letdown in the 4th quarter, even though he rarely takes a play off? He is about the most relentless player I've ever seen.
Dare I say it - Mr. Suh is a physical freak. In the same way Usain Bolt is a physical freak. Or Koby Bryant and Lebrom James.
Very good players come along all the time; great ones, heads and shoulders about his peers are rare. You are looking at a great one in Suh.
Posted by: Jeff Smith | Dec 7, 2009 7:06:55 PM
SUH will win every award he is eligible for, be the number one pick in the draft, get most every football Coaches heisman vote and still be in a tight race because of alot of homer writers. The Heisman is a joke. Ingram is a nice back, but is he a Reggie Bush, Barry Sanders, Billy Sims, Bo Jackson, etc, no. Suh is the Bo Jackson of football this year. His athletic talent and abilities outshined everyone this year and last year. Teams adjusted their whole schemes around trying to block this guy. He wasnt just one aspect of the defense, he was the defense and because of his dominance, his teammates were better. Like I said, Ingram is a nice back, but you could plug in 15 other backs behind Bamas line and get the same result. SUH wins and the heisman returns to being a legitimate award.
Posted by: scott | Dec 7, 2009 7:09:13 PM
Suh wins the Nagurski!
Don't think that was much of a surprise. He will need a truck for all of the hardware he'll be bringing home this week.
Truth be told, I think he has a slightly better shot at the Walter Camp than the H------, but I think he'll be able to find room for both trophies if he has to.
Posted by: I Love Suh | Dec 7, 2009 7:09:54 PM
The problem with the Suh argument is that his biggest issue are less quantifiable than an offensive player's. An example would be the Baylor game. Looking at Suh's stats, he had a so-so game. The fact is that he was double and triple teamed the whole game, which allowed Jared Crick to get 5 sacks! Look at the sack leaders again: only 4 of the top 25 are DT's; two of them are Crick and Suh. The rest are LB's and DE's, positions which have much more of a straight shot at the quarterback. This doesn't even get us to Quarterback hurries. Oh, and he might be 136 in tackles, but look who's around him? Suh is the first Defensive Linemen listed! This means that he is stopping that many more people at the line of scrimmage than any other linemen in the nation! The next Linemen on the list is Crick at 270. It's not until DE Koa Misi at 317 do we find another lineman. Ndamukong Suh is the real deal.
Posted by: Chuck | Dec 7, 2009 7:21:20 PM
@Archie: "Suh is 146th in the country in tackles, not what I would call outstanding."
It is outstanding when you consider he's a defensive tackle, a position whose impact is often not readily discernible by statistics. DTs are usually charged with grunt work like absorbing blockers and disrupting plays so others can make plays. Ndomukong Suh is a star at a position that doesn't lend itself to stardom.
Furthermore, Suh faces double teams on almost every single play, and still throws people around like rag dolls. He is virtually unblockable. Teams have to drastically alter their game plans to try to minimize the havoc he causes, and they're still not able to stop him.
Suh may or may not win the Heisman. But I do know this: the people who pay their mortgages based on their ability to evaluate the best football talent in America (draft analysts, NFL GMs, etc.) say Suh is the best player in the country.
Posted by: Bill F. | Dec 7, 2009 7:25:25 PM
Suh named nation's top defensive player
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4723494
CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- Nebraska defensive tackle Ndamukong Suh has won the Bronko Nagurski Trophy as the nation's top defensive player.
Suh beat out TCU defensive end Jerry Hughes, Alabama defensive tackle Terrence Cody, Iowa linebacker Pat Angerer and Tennessee safety Eric Berry for the Nagurski, awarded by the Charlotte Touchdown Club.
Just a few hours earlier Monday, Suh learned he also is one of five finalists for the Heisman Trophy, college football's most prestigious player of the year award.
Suh's dominating season included 4½ sacks in the Cornhuskers' 13-12 loss to Texas on Saturday night in the Big 12 championship game.
Posted by: Tee | Dec 7, 2009 7:26:52 PM
Where did you guys go? your last posting was 4 hours ago!!!
Posted by: Juan Orosco | Dec 7, 2009 7:29:43 PM
Where did you guys go? Your last posting was 4 hours ago!!
Posted by: Juan Orosco | Dec 7, 2009 7:30:38 PM
Best Football Player? You should have to be at least the best at your position. You should give a considerable boost to your team in your position. And you should make a difference on every snap of the ball that you are on the field. It shouldn't penalize players when they are on the bench nor should it penalize defensive players because they don't handle the ball.
Question: Does Florida beat Alabama this year if Ingram was on Florida's team? If yes, then Ingram is better than Florida'a back. Does Stanford have a better record if Ingram is on Stanford's team, if yes than he is better than Toby. If it is the other way around and Alabama would be better with Toby than Toby would be best RB....etc...and same with Tebow and McCoy at QB.
There are probably half a dozen RBs and QBs in the nation that could have been just as effective AND productive as the other 4 players being debated and invited. But I will say this with relative confidence, Suh on any other team increases that team's ability to win and dominate football games like no other player. He so far out distances himself on nearly every play of every game that adding him to Florida easily would have been the difference in that game. He is incredibly focused, selfless and overachieves causing havoc on every play that he is on the field. I doubt the RBs or QBs can say that about their performances as compared to the other top peers at their positions.
Don't forget about the lapses, mistakes and 'take-it-easy' plays that RBs and QBs get about every 3rd play. RBs don't get every touch and run fakes a lot of the times. QBs hand the ball off much of the time, do not block often, get hit a few times a game and rely heavily on their team for support.
Suh is individually good, every play, can be inserted into any program and make it better, and has to compete 100% of every play that he is on the field.
Best Football Player....
Posted by: Semi pro | Dec 7, 2009 7:34:28 PM
Folks:
Select stats:
Jared Crick - DT Neb
solo T Assist T tackles T loss Sacks
2.23 3.15 5.00 0.96 0.73
Average/game
Ndamukong - Suh DT Neb
3.85 2.46 5.86 1.50 0.92
Posted by: Jeff Smith | Dec 7, 2009 7:36:37 PM
Alright, BmaEngnr92, let's have the list - 20 D tackles in the last 20 years better than Suh. You opened your mouth, so let's produce.
I'm sure, being an enganneer and all (yes, I know it is spelled wrong) you can produce a list
I'll be waiting...
Posted by: Jeff Smith | Dec 7, 2009 7:46:35 PM
Alright, BmaEngnr92, let's have the list - 20 D tackles in the last 20 years better than Suh. You opened your mouth, so let's produce.
I'm sure, being an enganneer and all (yes, I know it is spelled wrong) you can produce a list
I'll be waiting...
Posted by: Jeff Smith | Dec 7, 2009 7:46:36 PM
The numbers have historically been off by an average of 1.8% which means the top three are statistically tied (or at least within the average margin of error) at this point. Any of those three are worthy, but for my money I'd take Suh.
Posted by: Justin | Dec 7, 2009 7:54:54 PM
To be honest, I don't see why people are arguing over the methodology and frontrunners at this point. From my point of view, this is a three way race between Suh, Ingram, and Gerhart. At this point, 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place have no meaning except those three are the top 3. The difference between 1st (Gerhart) and 3rd (Ingram) is 1.6%. That's WAY inside the margin of error for this system.
At this point, I would say McCoy has an outside chance of sneaking back in, but it seems very unlikely at this point. Tebow is obviously out of it. So basically, like I said, we're dealing with a three-way race.
About the only issue I take with this release (not that it matters) is it's identification with Gerhart as the frontrunner. He's not; a quick viewing of the past margins of error (which are still amazingly small) will prove that a 1.6% lead at this point means absolutely nothing.
Posted by: Luke | Dec 7, 2009 8:09:46 PM
To those who question the collective Pac-10 defensive effort, I give you Ted Miller's blog:
http://espn.go.com/blog/pac10/post/_/id/6119/myth-vs-reality-defense-in-the-pac-10
To those who would try to quote stats against Toby Gerhart, I give you Dave Fowkes:
Toby's feats include:
- 4 touchdowns and 136 yards in a loss to Cal, including a 61-yard run in his second carry.
- 200 yards and a 60-yard touchdown run in a win over Washington.
- 141 yards and 3 touchdowns in a win over UCLA.
- 125 yards and two touchdowns in a win over ASU, ranked #2 in the country in rush defense at the time (I thought the Pac-10 didn't play defense?).
- School-record 223 yards against Oregon on 38 carries, including 3 touchdowns, against No. 7 Oregon.
- 178 yards and 3 touchdowns against then No. 11 USC, AT USC.
- 205 rushing yards, 3 rushing touchdowns and a passing touchdown against Notre Dame, including the game-winning score (which Notre Dame gave him because they figured he'd score anyway with less time on the clock if they didn't give it up then).
Toby scored 15 touchdowns in his last five games, matching Mark Ingram's tally for the entire regular season plus the SEC championship. That 'Bama had the luxury of taking Ingram out early in several games speaks to the fact that they had a stronger team (and arguably played weaker competition), but I think it's more impressive that Gerhart stayed in longer each game and worked to carry his team to its best record in 9 years. It's worth mentioning that before the Cal game Stanford was in contention for the Pac-10 title, which was a laughable concept for non-believers at the beginning of the season.
Toby for Heisman!
Posted by: Jake | Dec 7, 2009 8:12:15 PM
If the SEC was so tough this year, why where the divisional races over so early? If teams were so tough then the divisional races would have gone down to the wire. People comment that the SEC is tough because they beat each other up. That's what happened in the Pac-10 this year and didn't happen in the SEC. So which is it?
Posted by: Tony | Dec 7, 2009 8:14:14 PM
As somebody stated above: "The problem with the Suh argument is that his biggest issue are less quantifiable than an offensive player's."
I would argue that is not true. How do you know how good Ingram or Gerhart really are? For every great runner, there are great blockers. For every great quarterback, there is somebody blocking for him and giving him time to make the throw.
Nobody helped Suh ... nobody! He is a one-man wrecking crew!
Posted by: Girth | Dec 7, 2009 8:41:09 PM
Topher is an idiot ! it was not a one point win against Auburn, and Alabama was up by 28 against Arkansas which is why saban played Richardson most of the game. he still had 50 and a TD in limited action.Saban could have padded Ingram stats in alot of games including SEC championship. but unlike other coaches( Meyer, Carrol)he likes to get young player reps! Ingram could have close to 2000 yards had saban padded them, but his focus is on team and as you can clearly see he has a team playing for the title in 3 years!!!
Posted by: jay | Dec 7, 2009 8:46:59 PM
OK lets look at gerhart defenses he has faced: ND-horrible, wake forest-awful, washington,washington st -please, USC-oh theres a good defense, UCLA-do they have a defense, Arizona -OMG are you for real .and dont forget san jose st. compared to ingram -Florida #1 def in country ,VA Tech top 15 DEF, LSU top 20 Def,South Carolina Top 20, Ole miss top 20, Tennessee#1 corner in the biz and top 25 defense. So please if Ingram could run against those pussies in the pac -10 he would be freakin barry Sanders!!!! My only Question is with that stanford schedule why didnt he set the NCAA Record if he's so good! so give me a call when he plays a real team that's not in the bitch-10
Posted by: jay | Dec 7, 2009 9:00:15 PM
Suh isredic, I agree but between Ingram and Gerhart there really is no competition. Say what you want, but it is a well known fact that the SEC is a largely defensive conference. On the Auburn game, you'd have to actually look at the game to see what went down. Auburn stacked the box anytime that Ingram got in the game. You can't seriously look at Gerhart and Ingram and tell me they are running against defenses of similar skills.
Posted by: Fred | Dec 7, 2009 9:00:19 PM
I respectfully disagree that Ingram is a better player, or running back, though he is good for sure. I think if he stays he will get better than he is now. I just think the numbers are so much better in Gerhart's favor. Ingram has better numbers in just one category: YPC. That is not a throw away but it is offset by Gerhart not having one game where he averaged less than 4.4 yards per carry, whereas Ingram had two games below 3 YPC.
Most importantly though, I just don't see how you take the Auburn game out of the equation. This game was huge to Alabama and Ingram didn't "show up". Compare, if you will, the go ahead drives of Alabama vs Auburn with Stanford vs Notre Dame. (for the record Auburn ranks 80th against the run and ND is 90th). Both teams were behind in huge games, on the last day of the "regular" season.
Gerhart produced 54 out of 75 yards and scored the game winning TD (after throwing the game tying TD the series before; on 4th down no less) to put his team in the lead to win. Everyone in Stanford Stadium knew that with the game tied, and 5 minutes to go, No. 7 was getting the ball. Yet he produced more yards rushing, and more points, than Ingram did in the entire Auburn game!
Posted by: Rod Anderson | Dec 7, 2009 9:08:18 PM
Any bets on whether or not Colt falls down when he see's Suh in the ceremony? He was hit so hard so many times by Suh that it should be second nature now. Who was the dork that pointed out how Suh is 147th in the nation in tackles? Where does he stand for defensive linemen and more than that, how many of those top tacklers were on the field play after play after play because they weren't stopping anyone? It's not just about how many tackles you get, it's also about where you get them and Suh dominated game after game. I had the pleasure of seeing him live this year and while Crick got the glory in that game, it was Suh that was slapping the O-Line around to free Crick up.
Posted by: hsrfn | Dec 7, 2009 9:14:55 PM
WHAT'S UP WITH ALL THE HYPE FOR SUH. IF YOU WATCH COLLEGE FOOTBALL GAMES FROM START TO FINISH AND NOT JUST THE ESPN HIGHLIGHTS YOU WOULD REALIZE SUH PROBABLY WOULD'NT START FOR FLORIDA. HE WOULD BE SECOND TEAM AT BEST FOR THE CRIMSON TIDE! DON'T JUST SAY HE'S THE BEST BECAUSE SOMEONE ELSE SAYS HE IS. WATCH THE WHOLE GAME AND YOU WILL REALIZE WHY NEBRASKA LOST 4 GAMES. HE'S NOT AS GREAT AS THE MEDIA AND FANS THINK HE IS.
Posted by: KC CRAWFORD | Dec 7, 2009 9:19:50 PM
AS FOR GERHART AND HIS HEISMAN LIKE SEASON AT STANFORD, I'M 47 YEARS OLD AND I COULD RUN OVER AND AROUND THE DEFENSES HE HAD TO FACE. MARK INGRAM SHOULD WIN THE TROPHY. HE PROBABLY WILL NOT BUT THATS OK THE TIDE LIKES THOSE TEAM TROPHYS (12 NAT'L TITLES) MORE THEN INDIVIDUAL POPULARITY CONTESTS.
Posted by: KC CRAWFORD | Dec 7, 2009 9:28:39 PM
KC Crawford must have never played football in his life. As a Miss State alum I love the SEC and root for bama when I can, and Suh is simply amazing to watch.
Posted by: KC DickForBrains | Dec 7, 2009 9:28:54 PM
I'm a Brit forced to spend the past 3 months living with football addicted Americans. It has been a fun time and I learned your game. I watched many games over the past month. I understand the passion for players on favorite teams. I do consider myself to be a neutral observer. Based on what I've seen the most outstanding of the players in the final list is the Toby Gerhart fellow. I noticed that he runs people over in the final minutes of games and plays until he can barely stand. His statistics reflect awesome ability, power and desire. If the Gerhart man wins this it is just.
Posted by: Ronald | Dec 7, 2009 9:30:28 PM
KC Crawford must have never watched football in his life. As an SEC alum I can honestly say I havnt seen the likes of Suh since Warren Sap, and Suh is even better.
Posted by: KC DickForBrains | Dec 7, 2009 9:30:41 PM
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